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Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:22 pm
by Nazuths
Mike wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 6:51 pm
For the record, our logs do not show anything when a player drops an item and picks it up again. It's only logged if it either disappears or is picked up by another player. Which means in this particular case, we have to go off on the proof that is being presented by both parties as the log don't show us anything.
Either way, in my opinion there is sufficient proof that Arrsenic did indeed scam the person involved. As such, I have permanently banned his account "Arrsenic". If he engages in scamming behavior again, he may find himself ip-banned. However, considering the whole situation, I'm afraid we cannot return the 1T risked to the person involved.
I don't think our rules are inherently flawed, but they were not (yet) properly enforced in this situation. However, I agree with staff that it was a tough case to decide on since the proof was mostly presented by other players who may be completely biased (and who most likely were, in this case). So let's not bash our staff team too hard for trying their best.
Out of curiosity, did Nimer refuse to pay the 1T? If so I understand the permanent ban, if not, why wouldn't paying the 1T and\or a temp ban suffice instead of a permanent ban? Seems a bit harsh to me.
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:26 pm
by The underdog
Nazuths wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:22 pm
Mike wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 6:51 pm
For the record, our logs do not show anything when a player drops an item and picks it up again. It's only logged if it either disappears or is picked up by another player. Which means in this particular case, we have to go off on the proof that is being presented by both parties as the log don't show us anything.
Either way, in my opinion there is sufficient proof that Arrsenic did indeed scam the person involved. As such, I have permanently banned his account "Arrsenic". If he engages in scamming behavior again, he may find himself ip-banned. However, considering the whole situation, I'm afraid we cannot return the 1T risked to the person involved.
I don't think our rules are inherently flawed, but they were not (yet) properly enforced in this situation. However, I agree with staff that it was a tough case to decide on since the proof was mostly presented by other players who may be completely biased (and who most likely were, in this case). So let's not bash our staff team too hard for trying their best.
Out of curiosity, did Nimer refuse to pay the 1T? If so I understand the permanent ban, if not, why wouldn't paying the 1T and\or a temp ban suffice instead of a permanent ban? Seems a bit harsh to me.
Harsh? If he gets the same treatment as his opponents in this thread then he'll be given a second or 100th chance in a week or two no matter what he did
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:31 pm
by Kalista
Nazuths wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:22 pm
Mike wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 6:51 pm
For the record, our logs do not show anything when a player drops an item and picks it up again. It's only logged if it either disappears or is picked up by another player. Which means in this particular case, we have to go off on the proof that is being presented by both parties as the log don't show us anything.
Either way, in my opinion there is sufficient proof that Arrsenic did indeed scam the person involved. As such, I have permanently banned his account "Arrsenic". If he engages in scamming behavior again, he may find himself ip-banned. However, considering the whole situation, I'm afraid we cannot return the 1T risked to the person involved.
I don't think our rules are inherently flawed, but they were not (yet) properly enforced in this situation. However, I agree with staff that it was a tough case to decide on since the proof was mostly presented by other players who may be completely biased (and who most likely were, in this case). So let's not bash our staff team too hard for trying their best.
Out of curiosity, did Nimer refuse to pay the 1T? If so I understand the permanent ban, if not, why wouldn't paying the 1T and\or a temp ban suffice instead of a permanent ban? Seems a bit harsh to me.
Likely because he scammed, bragged about it, and had multiple days to pay it back and didn't. I would imagine they don't want malicious people like that playing the game.
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:37 pm
by Mike
Kalista wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:31 pm
Nazuths wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:22 pm
Out of curiosity, did Nimer refuse to pay the 1T? If so I understand the permanent ban, if not, why wouldn't paying the 1T and\or a temp ban suffice instead of a permanent ban? Seems a bit harsh to me.
Likely because he scammed, bragged about it, and had multiple days to pay it back and didn't. I would imagine they don't want malicious people like that playing the game.
Whether or not to give the items back was rather beside the point (also because the player-made deals rule still stands, we cannot force someone to give items to another player if it is not covered by our rules, a middleman or a played made deal made on the forums), the main issue is that the scam took place at all and that he kept denying it while displaying toxic behavior toward anyone who disagreed with him, including our staff team.
Not that others are entirely free of blame. Some people, including the other party involved are more than deserving of a tempmute considering their behavior, but that doesn't give anyone the excuse to start scamming.
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:39 pm
by Nazuths
Kalista wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:31 pm
Nazuths wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:22 pm
Mike wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 6:51 pm
For the record, our logs do not show anything when a player drops an item and picks it up again. It's only logged if it either disappears or is picked up by another player. Which means in this particular case, we have to go off on the proof that is being presented by both parties as the log don't show us anything.
Either way, in my opinion there is sufficient proof that Arrsenic did indeed scam the person involved. As such, I have permanently banned his account "Arrsenic". If he engages in scamming behavior again, he may find himself ip-banned. However, considering the whole situation, I'm afraid we cannot return the 1T risked to the person involved.
I don't think our rules are inherently flawed, but they were not (yet) properly enforced in this situation. However, I agree with staff that it was a tough case to decide on since the proof was mostly presented by other players who may be completely biased (and who most likely were, in this case). So let's not bash our staff team too hard for trying their best.
Out of curiosity, did Nimer refuse to pay the 1T? If so I understand the permanent ban, if not, why wouldn't paying the 1T and\or a temp ban suffice instead of a permanent ban? Seems a bit harsh to me.
Likely because he scammed, bragged about it, and had multiple days to pay it back and didn't. I would imagine they don't want malicious people like that playing the game.
Can't expect him to do that when no Staff member has told him he's in the wrong, nor the rules do. If it was me, I also wouldn't give in to the people you know are out to bring you down.
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:53 pm
by Fe nis
Implying people should have to be told before they're aware that scamming, cheating and lying to people is wrong.
Right..
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:00 pm
by Fungamer
Nazuths wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:39 pm
Kalista wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:31 pm
Nazuths wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 9:22 pm
Out of curiosity, did Nimer refuse to pay the 1T? If so I understand the permanent ban, if not, why wouldn't paying the 1T and\or a temp ban suffice instead of a permanent ban? Seems a bit harsh to me.
Likely because he scammed, bragged about it, and had multiple days to pay it back and didn't. I would imagine they don't want malicious people like that playing the game.
Can't expect him to do that when no Staff member has told him he's in the wrong, nor the rules do. If it was me, I also wouldn't give in to the people you know are out to bring you down.
if your moral compass purely consists of the letter of the law then you're either a sociopath\psychopath or [self-censoring]
edit: Also if you're given the choice to be banned with 200t or pay 1t then obviously you're going to pay the 1t and all the "consequences" you got were being unsuccessful with a scam.
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:06 pm
by Patel
@Mike
Fungamer wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:00 pm
if your moral compass purely consists of the letter of the law then you're either a sociopath\psychopath or [self-censoring]
Well said
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:15 pm
by Ryun
Patel wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:06 pm
@Mike
Fungamer wrote: ↑Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:00 pm
if your moral compass purely consists of the letter of the law then you're either a sociopath\psychopath or [self-censoring]
Well said
+1
Re: Player Made Deals
Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2023 10:27 pm
by The underdog
Should clarify that scamming ipbanned scammers is against the rules then
